Julie Sumwalt
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I was asking for someone else, and you are right--you do need to see the print. (I know better, I do!) I can see now that three asterisks should not be used at all, since there is nothing there in print. Still, it is an interesting question. And as for apples and oranges, when one needs fruit, either will do. Thanks so much for your time.
First, apples and oranges. In addition the considerations you mention, the lesson manual is based on literary so it generally should not be consulted for formats. And I don't understand the relevance of the attribution. I really need to see this example. If this is a hypothetical, I can't help you much further than you've already helped yourself. Use the asterisk when it means an asterisk and not a reference indicator. It should be listed as special symbols. And again, the lesson manual is not appropriate for guidance about special symbols in a textbook.
--Joanna
Your interest in the new guidelines is certainly appreciated!
We are glad to answer questions here, but we need to point out that research on many of them can take hours. We simply don't have the time to deal with complex questions when there is no problem. Transcribers who pose questions here are asking about actual work they are doing and often have to stop that work while they wait for answers here.
I apologize if we haven't been clear on this, and we would like to gently suggest that the best way to learn thses guidelines is to use them. We'll be glad to help with real problems. As much as I enjoy the discussion, we just can't accommodate hypothetical questions, even with examples.
Thanks for your understanding.
--Joanna
I hope these examples will help. On page 215 there is a bit where the format changes from paragraphs to a more poetic form. The verse (chapter segment) numbers are along the left margin, not embedded within a paragraph. As I understand the guideline, we are then to put these verses in 3-1. All the regular paragraphs with embedded numbers around the poetic part are also in 3-1, so how is the braille reader to know that this part is different, that is, in poetic verses and not a bunch of short paragraphs?
Page 1000 shows a series of two-part sayings. The verse numbers are not embedded, so according to the guideline, these should also be in 3-1, but then the rhythm is lost.
Page 1119 shows a long passage of poetic text. There are verses (chapter segments) and verses (poetic stanzas). Again, how is the reader to know the difference between actual paragraphs and this sort of passage?
16.5.4 refers only to notes contained in quoted matter and does not concern other displayed materials. Section 9.2.2 says that it may be necessary to change the left margin for some types of displayed material and 16.5.4 is an example of that.
Section 16.5.4 only refers one to Section 9, which says that the adjusted left margin for displayed material is in cell 3 or, for exercises, in cell 5. I'm wondering why the quote in Sample 16-6 is in cell 5, since it is not an exercise. I like it there in cell 5, but I can find no guideline explaining why that should be. I'm hoping you can help me.
I'm not sure that abandon is an accurate characerization. All formatting decisions are based on what the text looks like and how it meant to be read. It is impossible to give more than a hypothetical suggestion for a hypothetical situation. Obviously there are no hard-and-fast rules, especially in the matter of wide tables, because these vary so much in print. That's why these are called guidelines. Options are given for wide tables and formatting decisions are made according to a particular situation. Abundant examples are also given in Formats to assist in that process. We're happy to help suggest solutions to any formatting situation you cate to ask about, but beyond the hypothetical, we need to see what it looks like.
--Joanna
Without a print page to provide context and actual placement, exercise directions (if any) and possibly a look at how other exercises are printed, only a hypothetical answer can be offered. Formats Section 10.10 should be followed regarding the T/F and 10.5, particularly 10.5.2 should be utilized regarding the numbered write-on lines.
--Joanna
Oh, I see. I was indeed missing the point, which is: If you can't tell from the print whether or not a new stanza has begun, don't put a blank line there because that would make two stanzas when it might actually be only one. I was reading it as "If the braille isn't clear at the page break, don't insert a blank line to make it clear" which of course confounded me.
I'm not referring to dates. What I mean is the
Connected Mathematics (TM) is a trademark of Michigan State University.
Pearson Prentice hall (TM) is a registered trademark of Pearson education, Inc.
etc.That said, it looks like the Common Core copyright info is put there because the Pearson folks need to acknoeledge that. So should I?
Suppose I need to add five blank lines between segments in order to make the information stretch from line 1 to line 25. I add one line between the volume segment and the transcriber segment. I still need more lines, so I add another blank one between the transcriber segment and the publisher segment. Then another between the publisher and author, and author and title. I still need one more line, so I go back down to the bottom and add one more between the volume and transcriber segments. That's starting from the bottom, which is how we're told to do our literary manuscripts. Starting from the top would be the reverse, adding a blank line first between the title and author, then author and publisher, on down the page and coming back up if more lines are needed. That's what the Formats manuals, 1997 and 2011, show.
Sorry, I'd knew you'd want an example, but this question came up as I was working on a confidential test and I can't seem to make one up at the moment. Your response is what I need to know, though. Thanks.
It says simply that blank lines are inserted between segments and are distributed as evenly as possible. There is no mention of starting from the top or the bottom. I do have to say that I'm not clear on what you mean by that--starting from the top of the bottom. I've never heard that described in that way before and I don't know what you mean. Could you please explain it?
--Joanna
